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Poll: Not Microsoft at all, ever again - UPDATE 04/05/2017 - Gone back to Apple
Better the devil you know - stick with Apple; if it ain't broke... 14 (43.75%)
Do it! (I have loads of Microsoft stuff and it all works well) 8 (25%)
Do it! (I'd be interested to hear how shit an all-Microsoft setup is without spending any of my own money) 10 (31.25%)


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Author Not Microsoft at all, ever again - UPDATE 04/05/2017 - Gone back to Apple
evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 12:33   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

Apparently the Lumia 1020 with its 41MP camera will be out on the 12th. I may consider that instead of the 920, depends how outrageously expensive it is:

http://www.techradar.com/news/phone-and-communications/mobile-phones/nokia-lumia-1020-release-date-confirmed-as-september-12-1179613
A2H GO
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10th Sep 13 at 12:33   View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Dom
quote:
Originally posted by A2H GO
...so has a major lack of content/apps.


Most over used WP negative by people that know little about the platform. Fact is, majority of people use a dozen apps, if that, at most and in a lot of cases there are perfectly good alternatives for WP.



Like Instagram?

People don't want knock off alternatives built using work arounds by unknown companies, especially if they have to start entering personal data.

Also any new stuff generally tends to come to Android/iOS first, leaving WP users waiting months, if it ever comes at all.
Rob_Quads
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10th Sep 13 at 12:34   View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

I agree lots of the general apps do have alternatives but as soon as you start looking for product specific apps then WP has its problems.

Prime example - Sky Go, Sky+, Virgin TV Anywhere.

Even if the WP is supported its often a release behind as the developers work on iOS & Android first i.e. iPlayer does not support Downloads

Its getting better but its still a chunk behind
Marc
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10th Sep 13 at 12:35   View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

I can probably save you some time -

Had Windows laptops since 2003. A Compaq and 2 Dells. Using Windows XP Home/Professional & Vista.

Microsoft IE is so unstable and slow. Multiple crashing during regular browsing, doesn't like websites with a lot going on. Java etc. Sky Sports and Man United website being prime examples. Mozilla Fireforx is a lot better but still crashes from time to time.

Had an iPhone 4 and now a 5. Best phones I've ever had, although I came from a Sony C905. No issues with the phone and the apps are either useful or fun.

Recently bought a Mac Book Pro 17". Still getting to grips with the differences and granted it is annoying that a few little things are missing - Viewing picture folders as slide shows, no home key and the fact that most things require a 3 key combination. Upgraded to Mountain Lion from Lion for 11.99. Can you do that with Mircosoft for that price?! As for crashing, on very rare occasions Safari has frozen but never crashes to the extent that you need to force shut down. Also miss MS Paint, came in very handy.

I use Outlook.com when at work and Mac Mail when at home. No issues with either. On the Windows laptop I had Windows Mail installed. All very similar.
evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 12:43   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Marc
Viewing picture folders as slide shows

You can do this using Quick Look - go to the folder with the photos in, select the ones you want to slideshow (or Command+A to select all) then hit space. There should be a fullscreen icon in the top right - hit that; hey presto - slideshow.

http://dailymactips.com/2012/02/21/using-the-slide-show-feature-in-quick-look/
evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 12:48   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Rob_Quads
I agree lots of the general apps do have alternatives but as soon as you start looking for product specific apps then WP has its problems.

Prime example - Sky Go, Sky+, Virgin TV Anywhere.

Even if the WP is supported its often a release behind as the developers work on iOS & Android first i.e. iPlayer does not support Downloads

Its getting better but its still a chunk behind

Valuable insight - thanks!

I don't use any of those things though, luckily - so not a deal breaker for me.
evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 12:52   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by ed
buying things based on the name on the front of them over their merits is a bit bizarre too.

Although not listed in this thread, I have done my homework on each element of the all-Microsoft setup.

Check out my in-depth analysis of the Surface RT in this thread:
http://www.corsasport.co.uk/board/viewthread.php?tid=658421
Dom
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10th Sep 13 at 12:54   View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Marc
Upgraded to Mountain Lion from Lion for 11.99. Can you do that with Microsoft for that price?!


You can't directly compare the OS costs as Apple offsets it against the cost of hardware ie - you need (debatable but that's for a different thread) Apple hardware to run the OS. Microsoft on the other hand primarily deals with software and they can't do the same.


quote:
Originally posted by Marc
As for crashing, on very rare occasions Safari has frozen but never crashes to the extent that you need to force shut down.


Having used Macs for 11 years, since OS9, i can happily say that OS X crashes just as much as Windows - difference is, you have to put up with a spinning beach ball or kernel panic rather than a blue screen and the system rebooting.

And while i agree that IE isn't brilliant, although it's certainly getting better with IE10, i wouldn't say Safari is the saving grace of browsers neither as it has it's own fair share of issues.

As always, it's horses for courses and all subjective.
evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 12:56   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Dom
Rob - If you fancy a change then do it. Although my issue is that no ecosystem is perfect - Microsoft's isn't and neither is Apple's. You're better off mixing and matching providers to get the best experience.

Cheers, Dom.

I'm under no illusion that Microsoft's offerings are perfect; but if I'm going to compare Apples and Microsofts properly, I need to go all-in. Then I will be in a position to decide which ecosystem does what better, or if actually, they're both good for most things most of the time and it comes down to which of the things that one does that the other doesn't as to which platform is best for me.
pow
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10th Sep 13 at 13:13   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

Dom has hit the nail on the head really.

I use Gmail (with a number of addresses) so having an andriod phone that intigrates seemlessly with Gmail and calendars contact etc works well. When I bought my iPad there wern't many decent Andriod tablets about so the iPad is best for the sofa internet browsing, facebook and rightmove. But I couldn't live without my Windows 8 laptop that does absolutely everything.

Multi platform, each device doing exactly what I want it to.
Kyle T
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10th Sep 13 at 13:59   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Marc
Had Windows laptops since 2003. A Compaq and 2 Dells. Using Windows XP Home/Professional & Vista.



You've never tried W7/W8 so your comments on the (recent) Mac OS/browsers is invalid tbh


Lotus Elise 111R

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evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 13:59   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

All I need is email/contacts/calendar, internets, photos, films and music accessible across phone, tablet and computer, streamable to the telly. iCloud/AirPlay does this well. I want to see how Microsoft's effort shapes up.

This all came about because the Mrs Swapped her iPad for an RT and loves it. It is much better than the reviews would have you believe. So I wanted one of those anyway.

I've mostly been underwhelmed by iOS7 so was going to chop it in for a Windows phone, just for a change of scene.

Then I was thinking about ditching Gmail because Google are getting a bit too evil and they don't pay enough tax.

Next best thing so I've heard is outlook.com which would sync up nicely with Windows Phone and Windows RT obviously.

Similarly, Windows phone is the next best thing after Android which I don't want for the same reason I'm looking to ditch Gmail.

Easiest way to get music and films would then be via Xbox music and video services, which would be accessible across all my Microsoft devices. (Replacing iTunes and Spotify)

I was going to buy a current gen console just for GTA V anyway as I sold my PS3 years ago. Logical choice is Xbox because I can then use it to get content from my Windows phone and tablet onto the telly / speakers, replacing the Apple TV.

Before you know it - you're in an all-Microsoft environment!
Kyle T
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10th Sep 13 at 14:02   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Dom
You're better off mixing and matching providers to get the best experience.



This is my approach, most of the "mainstream" apps can be logged into across multiple platforms for example Netflix and Spotify so there's no benefit there to invest in a "system".

If you're a heavy MS Office worker I think there are benefits to WP / W8 as you can be reading a document on your PC for example then immediately open it on the same page etc on your phone... but personally I don't use Office so it isn't something which appeals to me particularly.

I've got a W8 PC, W7 Laptop, RT Surface, iPad and Galaxy S3 so I'm about as mixed as it gets - and I've never felt held back by it to be honest, and they've all got their place.


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Dom
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10th Sep 13 at 14:20   View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by evilrob
Then I was thinking about ditching Gmail because Google are getting a bit too evil and they don't pay enough tax.

Next best thing so I've heard is outlook.com which would sync up nicely with Windows Phone and Windows RT obviously.


Obviously, Gmail won't integrate as nicely (same with iOS tbf) as it does on Android and you'll still have to an Outlook account for syncing but after having both, Gmail still offers better spam filters and the Gmail web interface is still a lot easier to use (personal opinion perhaps).

Although if you've got spare a few pounds a months then a Office 365 account is worth while getting - yes, it still uses a similar interface to Outlook.com for OWA but you obviously get full blown Exchange underneath it.


quote:
Originally posted by evilrob
Easiest way to get music and films would then be via Xbox music and video services, which would be accessible across all my Microsoft devices. (Replacing iTunes and Spotify)

You'd still be better off with Spotify for music streaming, various other providers for purchasing music (Amazon is cheaper than iTunes for starters) and Netflix for your video viewing (again cheaper than iTunes).
A2H GO
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10th Sep 13 at 14:33   View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote



I'm starting to like Google.

http://wmpoweruser.com/gmail-mobile-web-app-for-windows-phone-devices-gets-a-new-look/
Rob_Quads
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10th Sep 13 at 14:36   View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by evilrob
Then I was thinking about ditching Gmail because Google are getting a bit too evil and they don't pay enough tax.



Seriously. Well you better forget about going to Microsoft as they pay sod all tax as well....on and Apple...Oh and... yes every big corp out there is doing it.
evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 14:37   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Dom
Obviously, Gmail won't integrate as nicely (same with iOS tbf) as it does on Android and you'll still have to an Outlook account for syncing but after having both, Gmail still offers better spam filters and the Gmail web interface is still a lot easier to use (personal opinion perhaps).

Although if you've got spare a few pounds a months then a Office 365 account is worth while getting - yes, it still uses a similar interface to Outlook.com for OWA but you obviously get full blown Exchange underneath it.

I like your thinking - noted.

quote:
Originally posted by Dom
You'd still be better off with Spotify for music streaming, various other providers for purchasing music (Amazon is cheaper than iTunes for starters) and Netflix for your video viewing (again cheaper than iTunes).

I'm happy to rent music for the time being to enjoy new releases that I typically listen to for a short while then don't particularly want to listen to again (they don't make 'em like they used to!)

I already bought all my long-term favourites on CD, which are now ripped to high bitrate MP3. I may well end up going back to Spotify (although there is no RT Spotify client currently, the web-based interface works nicely), but as part of the all-Microsoft experiment, Xbox Music is a quid cheaper a month at 8.99 and natively accessible from all Microsoft devices (whether or not the catalogue is on par is another matter, this remains to be seen):



I've flirted with the likes of Lovefilm Instant and Netflix before - but I'm quite happy to rent occasional new movie releases ad hoc at around a 3.50-4.50 a go or whatever the going rate is, rather than consume masses of older films and shows. Xbox Video seems to have as good a selection as any other.

[Edited on 10-09-2013 by evilrob]
evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 14:48   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Rob_Quads
quote:
Originally posted by evilrob
Then I was thinking about ditching Gmail because Google are getting a bit too evil and they don't pay enough tax.



Seriously. Well you better forget about going to Microsoft as they pay sod all tax as well....on and Apple...Oh and... yes every big corp out there is doing it.

I strongly advise you not to go down this road. I promise you I understand tax better than you do:

Volume 1 of 12:


What irks me about Google's tax avoidance is Eric Schmidt's arrogance about the whole thing:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22676080

At least Microsoft funnel a lot of the cash from their UK operations through Ireland which is a lot closer to home than Bermuda.

edit: edited to correct Luxembourg to Bermuda

[Edited on 10-09-2013 by evilrob]
Rob_Quads
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quote:
Originally posted by evilrob. I promise you I understand tax better than you do:
.


Strong assumption , probably true in this case but still think they are all as bad as each other, MS use Ireland because it works well for them. If they wanted to I am sure they would move it else where if it was worth the hassle. They are certainly not using Ireland to 'help the British economy".
A2H GO
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10th Sep 13 at 15:10   View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by evilrob
quote:
Originally posted by Rob_Quads
quote:
Originally posted by evilrob
Then I was thinking about ditching Gmail because Google are getting a bit too evil and they don't pay enough tax.



Seriously. Well you better forget about going to Microsoft as they pay sod all tax as well....on and Apple...Oh and... yes every big corp out there is doing it.


At least Microsoft funnel a lot of the cash from their UK operations through Ireland which is a lot closer to home than Luxembourg.


From the link you posted...

"Google, most of whose UK sales are routed through Ireland..."

[Edited on 10-09-2013 by A2H GO]
evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 15:15   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Rob_Quads
quote:
Originally posted by evilrob. I promise you I understand tax better than you do:
.


Strong assumption , probably true in this case but still think they are all as bad as each other, MS use Ireland because it works well for them. If they wanted to I am sure they would move it else where if it was worth the hassle. They are certainly not using Ireland to 'help the British economy".

You're right, I was being a massive cunt - I apologise for that. It's considerably more complicated than "they are all as bad as each other" though - Google's accounts make no sense at all.

In any case, we've gone off topic so we will have to agree to disagree. I don't like Google for various reasons, and no-one is going to convince me otherwise. Android is off the menu. Blackberry is obviously not going to work for anyone. I have the choice of sticking with Apple or switching to Microsoft.

[Edited on 10-09-2013 by evilrob]
evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 15:28   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by A2H GO
From the link you posted...

"Google, most of whose UK sales are routed through Ireland..."

Google have a highly contrived tax arrangement and claims that its advertising sales take place in Ireland, which isn't true - the staff in Ireland only print the invoices.

I got it wrong - they actually funnel the rest of the cash to Bermuda as 'intellectual property' licensing payments, not Luxembourg - I was thinking of Amazon.

Can we just get over the 'your reasons for disliking Google are invalid' argument and get back on topic please?

[Edited on 10-09-2013 by evilrob]
Balling
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10th Sep 13 at 15:37   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Dom
quote:
Originally posted by A2H GO
...so has a major lack of content/apps.
Most over used WP negative by people that know little about the platform. Fact is, majority of people use a dozen apps, if that, at most and in a lot of cases there are perfectly good alternatives for WP.
I still disagree with you on this and I believe I've made the following arguments before.

Yes, when Tim Cook takes the stage tonight and boasts about several trillion apps on App Store, it's a hollow truth.

However, it's a fact that to every big city I've traveled I've been able to download an app for their social transport system. Heck, for London I could pick and choose from dozens of apps to help me find the right tube and the one I ended up using was, despite being free of charge, an amazing little app that did all but board the train for me.
Some cities might have a WP app as well, but chances are it's made by some guy in his spare time and is updated twice a year.

Another fact is, that over here in our small country every bank, small or large, has an online banking app for making transfers and checking your account on the go. Yet I can't think of a single bank that supports other platforms than Android and iOS.
I don't believe the majority of UK will be much different.

Third fact, every single event I've been to in the last couple of years has had a smartphone app for looking at the event program, details, maps etc. to help me as a visitor.
I see this advertised for Android and iOS, not WP or any other platform.

When I travel I purchase interactive Lonely Planet Guides, when I see friends and colleague play the latest big game hit like Wordfeud, I want in on the action.

These might all be minor things, but on the whole I couldn't live with WP simply for the hard truth that developers don't acknowledge it's existence and hence I'd feel like I was missing out on a lot.


Rob_Quads
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10th Sep 13 at 15:38   View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by evilrob
Blackberry is obviously not going to work for anyone.


That we can agree on. Within a few years I can see them being software only and then being bought out.

personally I don't think the effort of going all 1 company is not worth the hassle. If your wanting to spend some money just upgrade what you have.
evilrob
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10th Sep 13 at 15:49   View Garage View User's Profile U2U Member Reply With Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Rob_Quads
quote:
Originally posted by evilrob
Blackberry is obviously not going to work for anyone.


That we can agree on.



quote:
Originally posted by Rob_Quadspersonally I don't think the effort of going all 1 company is not worth the hassle. If your wanting to spend some money just upgrade what you have.

Fair point. It would be a massive pain in the arse.

Probably wouldn't end up costing me all that much though, given that I'd stick all the Apple stuff on eBay to offset the cost of the Microsoft kit. Unless it turns out that an all-Microsoft setup is so bad I can't live with it for a whole technology cycle and I end up having to re-buy Apple stuff again.

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