xa0s
Banned
Registered: 4th Mar 08
Location: Dartford, Kent Car: Turbo'd Fabia vRS
User status: Offline
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Me and a few mates were out tonight and a guy I know crashed into a kerb which broke something suspension related as the wheel had almost fallen off. The car was resting on it's sump and the other wheel. The damaged side still had the wheel attached, but it was just laying there at a very dodgy angle.
The car was sat in the middle of the road on a wide roundabout at 3am in the morning -- two cars had their hazard lights on. People could pass safely.
Recovery was called by the driver and due to arrive 'soon' -- meanwhile, the police went past and stopped. They inspected the car and done the normal stuff. After 30 (ish) minutes the recovery arrived, but it was a truck that pulls the cars onto the ramp... Not ideal for a car resting on it's sump. I explained to the driver and the police that this will cause more damage as the damaged side wheel will be pushed into the undamaged wing, as well as dragging the car along on it's sump, bumper and other bits which were also surprisingly undamaged.
I spoke to the recovery driver and he agreed with me, but said a crane-style truck would take a 'long time' to arrive. The police said it's unacceptable for the car to be in the road for what could be hours, so they said they'd call out their own recovery which will be crane-styled and lift the car onto the truck without doing any damage, but it'll cost £150 and £20-per-day storage. Slightly annoyed at this point, but fair enough -- you can see their point.
We wait for a further 45 (ish) minutes and I see a PJM truck coming down the road which looked identical to the previous recovery truck. I was a little confused at this point, so went to clarify with the recovery driver but got bluntly ignored. The recovery driver began getting things ready to drag the car onto the ramp so I approached the police. You could tell they were as confused as I was, but they said it had been long enough and it needs to be moved right now as they can't sit there all night.
I mentioned it would have been moved nearly an hour ago, but they knew they were wrong and just ignored me. The driver of the car was clearly shook-up and quite upset about damaging his car, and obviously didn't want further damage done to it.
But no, no-one would listen to any of us and when we stood in the way of the car being dragged, so they threatened to arrest us. The police were adamant all the damage would be covered by his insurance, but soon shut-up when we told him he was TPO.
In the end, the car driver just gave up and allowed them to do it -- I certainly wouldn't have but there's nothing I can do when the personal involved isn't doing anything about it.
I began recording the car being dragged to show the damage being caused, but the recovery guy told me to stop or he wouldn't continue -- GREAT SUCCESS, we can now call the original recovery out and avoid paying £150 and £20-per-day storage, but the car driver just wanted it to go there and then so once again, it was pointless me fighting and just had to unfortunately leave it.
The car was dragged on the bumper, sump and broken wheel, which pushed and creased the undamaged wing -- it certainly caused more damage, even if it is only minimal... But that's besides the point, he still had to pay £150 more than he should of had to, and he was also stood out in the rain for a further hour for absolutely no reason what-so-ever.
Now, I know it doesn't involve me directly, but I love knowing my rights and I hate scummy police that think they're above you -- everyone knew it'd be a different story if it was their car being damaged.
So, what's your opinion/advice on my entertaining night out? Acceptable by the police or not?
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Ian
Site Administrator
Registered: 28th Aug 99
Location: Liverpool
User status: Offline
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Generally the recovery companies who the Police instruct are a complete rip-off and only interested in taking your money to close the incident as quickly as possible so the Police can get back to eating donuts. If you're TPO then basically tough, you'll pay daft money to move the car and if it's damaged any further you don't have any real comeback due to you technically instructing that company even though you are in a bit of a corner to do so after the threat of obstruction (which doesn't matter what time it was - you can't obstruct the public right of way).
What you should do is move the car yourself so it's parked legally and then find a company who will move it at a reasonable cost without further damage, although I fear it's a bit late for that.
The rain and how far you sat there is beside the point. TP means you generally have to resolve the predicament you're in - if this means clearing an obstructive vehicle as quickly as possible or relying on whatever recover someone else appoints then there you are - unless you had the means to do it better yourself then you're not really in a position to challenge the way the Police dealt with it.
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Jamie_Hastings1
Member
Registered: 14th Aug 08
Location: Sanquhar, Dumfries and Galloway
User status: Offline
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Very similar happend to me. Attempted a roundabout a little too fast and clipped the kerb. Only damage was a snapped ball joint but obviously i couldnt drive it. The police arrived and seemed ok. As cars could still pass and it wasnt too busy at the time. The recovery wagon arrived and dragged it all the way up the road and onto the ramp. Pushing the the wheel right back into the wing. He said if he used the crane to lift me it would buckle the shell. And it wouldnt go on the ramp square so he kept pushing it and dented the quater panel. They charged me £202 for a recovery even though if i was with the AA they had a few reasons for charging me..1. My mate requested a crane. 2. AA doesnt pay for recoverys at roundabouts 3.It was because he was there for so long.  All of which are lies. If been to see them and got no where. And everytime a send them a letter they get AMEY highways to send me a bill for the clean up £500  This can get expensive if you have no other options at the time.
[Edited on 11-04-2009 by Jamie_Hastings1]
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gtitim
Member
Registered: 13th Feb 05
Location: the boonies
User status: Offline
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From a police perspective - I deal with this kind of thing alot. I like modified cars, but have a job to do. My priority at an RTC with no injuries or broken down vehicle is to clear the road ASAP, and get traffic moving. If you have recovery, and are not blocking the road i will leave you be. If you are causing an obstruction, the car's moving, whether we push it out of way, or i get my recovery contractor to move it. Further damage to vehicles is not my concern, I have a job to do, and the fact you only insured it TPFT is your lookout.
Sorry if thats harsh, but I have other jobs to do besides direct traffic because you have broken down or crashed, and am stretched enough as is.
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Ben G
Member
Registered: 12th Jan 07
Location: Essex
User status: Offline
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when my car was damaged, wheel looked like the arden blue one pictured above, the police allowed us to move it to the side of the road out of the way and let us tow it half a mile back to my house with my uncle kicking the wheel to stop it damaging the wing further
sounds like you just got arsey cops mate, although the weather last night wasn't the best, so i do understand them also.
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Tappits
Member
Registered: 25th Mar 05
Location: Rotherham
User status: Offline
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prob just the police been nobs.
when my bottem ball joint snaped on the corsa whyle towing my other corsa round a main rounderbout on a friday afternoon at about 3 in the inside lane completley blocking off half the roundabout, coppers came put some cones out allthe way round to stop people useing the lain and then whent off while i sat there 1mile away from home for 3h wating for 1: some one to come to pick up the corsa that was been towed and then a diff truck to pick up the other one (all in all 5 AA vans/trucks came to help me) all free of charge (other than the onece yearly charge for the privalige.
so i would just say it was the coppers been nobs if thay let me do that were and when it was with no fuss
[Edited on 11-04-2009 by Tappits]
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Sam
Moderator
Premium Member
Registered: 24th Dec 99
Location: West Midlands
User status: Offline
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I suppose it depends on the situation/circumstances really.
Also, like any profession, you get 'alright' people and you get jobsworth knob jockeys in the police.
Personally I'm not a fan of the police, as most of the coppers I've ever had the displeasure of meeting were stuck up their own arse, arrogant tossers throwing their weight around (and I talk of past experiences where I've had to call them to deal with certain emergency incidents where somebody was in trouble - not because I've been pulled over or anything).
Your friend would do well to get some legal advice on this whole saga - again like I said it all depends on the situation/circumstances, and I don't claim to be an expert on whether things the police or recovery agents do is right or wrong.
[/my two cents worth]
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lozarus
Member
Registered: 29th Oct 06
Location: Walderslade, Kent
User status: Offline
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just outa interest who's car?
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xa0s
Banned
Registered: 4th Mar 08
Location: Dartford, Kent Car: Turbo'd Fabia vRS
User status: Offline
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The thing is, he pays yearly for recovery and got his recovery there in 30 minutes. It would have been done there and then for free, but we all agreed (including the police) that it needs a crane to lift the car on and it'd cost £150.
[Edited on 11-04-2009 by xa0s]
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Bonney
Member
Registered: 14th Nov 04
Location: St Helens
User status: Offline
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Read something similar somewhere else. Aparantly a solicitor got involved and stated that if any cash had exchanged hands, The person who was doing the recovery had entered into a contract. Basically it is that the recovery company picked up the car for reward, which basically means that they had a duty of picking the car up with resonable respect and care for the vehicle. But if they were doing it as a favour where no money has exchanged havds basically they can remove it however they see fit, Like just dragging it onto a low loader as quick as possable.
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xa0s
Banned
Registered: 4th Mar 08
Location: Dartford, Kent Car: Turbo'd Fabia vRS
User status: Offline
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Well, it's minimal damage, but it's the fact he had to pay £150 for the privilege. His own recovery was there way before and would have recovered it for free, but he didn't want more damage to his car.
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Ian
Site Administrator
Registered: 28th Aug 99
Location: Liverpool
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by gtitim
I have a job to do
Serve the public wasn't it?
I think in this instance they've bent his car unnecessarily. Although the moral of this story is Police and recovery companies actually don't care, the vehicle is not the priority and you need FC insurance so you can sit back and watch them bugger the job up rather than interfere.
I had a similar incident in 1997 and my car was written off, thanks in part to the additional damage caused while loading it.
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gtitim
Member
Registered: 13th Feb 05
Location: the boonies
User status: Offline
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Correct - serve the public. However, that can be interpreted in different ways, clearly. Bottom line is that the road needs clearing as quickly and safely as possible. The car's damaged and cant be moved and so needs recovering. I would have asked for a full HiAblift personally, but thats because i like cars. Some of us do, others dont. if you get an officer who isnt bothered by cars then they aren't as sympathetic.
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