Craig W
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Registered: 31st Oct 00
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For the last week or so ive had 3 police men on trial. Ones a PS and the other 2 are PC's. All on trial for ABH. All found guilty today.
It was a very, very strange case, but the long and short of it was that the prosecution said that the actions used on a particular victim were delivered with unreasonable force, and therefore unlawful.
The judge said at the end that although his words carry no weight on the disciplinary side of things, he'd be 'shocked and disgusted' if they lost their jobs, as it was a simple case of wrong judgement, rather than police bullying which sometimes happens. He said from the evidence all officers were extremley competent and very good at their jobs.
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TNM
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Registered: 5th Apr 04
Location: Nottingham Drives: VW Tiguan
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i think some times coppers get a bit carried away in the moment.
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Ian
Site Administrator
Registered: 28th Aug 99
Location: Liverpool
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Reassuring that no-one is above the law.
Easily done though. I would beat up scum-bags given the opportunity.
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Craig W
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Registered: 31st Oct 00
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As i said it was a strange case, even prosecution witnesses were saying that the officers on trial acted reasonabley and added weight to the defence case.
The PS struck the man on the back of the leg 3 times with his baton, and the 2 PC's each sprayed him with CS gas.
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vibrio
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Registered: 28th Feb 01
Location: POAH
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quote:
Originally posted by Craig W
For the last week or so ive had 3 police men on trial. Ones a PS and the other 2 are PC's. All on trial for ABH. All found guilty today.
It was a very, very strange case, but the long and short of it was that the prosecution said that the actions used on a particular victim were delivered with unreasonable force, and therefore unlawful.
The judge said at the end that although his words carry no weight on the disciplinary side of things, he'd be 'shocked and disgusted' if they lost their jobs, as it was a simple case of wrong judgement, rather than police bullying which sometimes happens. He said from the evidence all officers were extremley competent and very good at their jobs.
the person that mae the complaint was probably a scum bag and deserved it
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vibrio
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Registered: 28th Feb 01
Location: POAH
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quote:
Originally posted by Craig W
As i said it was a strange case, even prosecution witnesses were saying that the officers on trial acted reasonabley and added weight to the defence case.
The PS struck the man on the back of the leg 3 times with his baton, and the 2 PC's each sprayed him with CS gas.
WTF was he doing to get that 
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drax
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Registered: 5th Feb 05
Location: Sittingbourne, Kent
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haha!
Anyone seen the boondock saints? Thats what we need.
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richysport
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Registered: 15th Apr 05
Location: Flintshire, north wales
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craig w what do u do for a living
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TNM
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Registered: 5th Apr 04
Location: Nottingham Drives: VW Tiguan
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quote:
Originally posted by richysport
craig w what do u do for a living
He is a judge 
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Ally
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Registered: 2nd Jul 03
Location: Pontypool Drives: a Skoda
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Its a shame that people who choose to make a living by protecting and helping others can be taken to court for it. Fucking joke.
Hit 3 times on the leg with a baton and sprayed with cs gas how on earth is that excessive force
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John
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Registered: 30th Jun 03
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All depends on what they guy was doing.
If he was killing kids thats fair enough.
If he swore when an officer walked by its a bit harsh.
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Carl
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Registered: 9th May 04
Location: Jimmy Bennett's la la land.
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quote:
Originally posted by John
All depends on what they guy was doing.
If he was killing kids thats fair enough.
If he swore when an officer walked by its a bit harsh.
He wouldn't swear at a copper again though would he.
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Paul
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Registered: 16th Apr 02
Location: Oop north.
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quote:
Originally posted by drax
haha!
Anyone seen the boondock saints? Thats what we need.
What a superb film. I can watch that film time and time again. First time is a bit boring as so much is going on and you only get half a story second time round is ace
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Craig W
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Registered: 31st Oct 00
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As i said, very strange case. Not going to post up all the evidence because that'd take me forever and a day.
But basically the guy had mental problems (manic depressant). He was at his monthly check up and they was extremley concerned for him so they was going to admit him into care for a few days to get his medication sorted out. He got a bit anxious and departed the clinic. They thought he was going to kill himself so they rang the police. He'd gone home to sort a few things out before going to hospital, and at the time the police got there he was walking along the road with his 14 year old son and a larger than average horse. He was moving the horse into his neighbours stable for when he went into care.
The police officers were mis-informed by their control, they was basically told he was extremlely violent and on a suicide mission. The officers *believed* that he had been sectioned, so in their minds they had the power to detain him under the mental health act. However, the final bit of paperwork to section him hadn't been completed, but they didnt know that. They asked him to stop etc and he completely ignored them. They told him they wanted to help him and have a chat but he continued to walk down the road, with boy and horse, without even giving the officers any kind of responce. He says when he's in a depressed state he withdraws into himself and doesnt want to talk to anyone. The prosecution said he had every right to ignore them, he was a law abiding citizen going about his every day life. He also said because of his ilness he likes to set himselfs tasks because it makes him feel better about himself. His task for the day was to move his horse from his stable to his neighbours stable, thats all that was in his mind. He said it was like he had tunnel vision, thats all he wanted to do.
So... he carried on and got into his neighbours stable yard. The polices objective was to not let him enter the stable where their 'could be weapons'. Afterall, they was informed he was a violent man who wanted to kill himself. It got to make or break time where he was about to enter the stable and an officer tried to grap his arm to get him away from the horse (all officers said they saw the horse as an extremem threat also). He resisted and shrugged the officer off, at which point he drew his baton and struck him 3 times on the back of the leg. This had no effect what so ever. Another officer drew his baton and the man disarmed him of it. So now the guy has a horse in one hand, and a baton in the other. He offers no aggression what so ever, he still just wants to get the horse in the stable. The officers see him as a bigger threat with 2 potential weapons so another officer draws his CS gas and sprays him. This has no effect. The third officer draws his CS gas and sprays him. This has no effect. Still, the man offers no aggression at all. He enters the stable with the horse.
Throughout the whole incident he didnt let go of the horse.
Whatthe police didnt know was that the stable yard had CCTV, so it's all on tape.
Perosnally i thought they'd get a not guilty, even prosectuion witnesses were saying that going on the information they was given, the fact that he didn't respond to the officers at all, and the fact he had potential weapons and was on an apparant suicide mission the actions were justified.
It all ended without any further violence.
Looking at the incident as a whole joint enterprise you could say they was wrong, but going by each officers actions. IE baton strikes with no effect, him disarming the officer, and then CS spray - all officers acted as the incident unfolded with incrimental decisions.
Essay... as i said it was a strange case, and without hearing everything you cant really judge, but im sure you'll have views from what ive said.
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Craig W
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Registered: 31st Oct 00
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The prosecution also said that walking down the road with your horse and your 14 year old son are hardly the actions of a man with a mission to kill himself...
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Craig W
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Registered: 31st Oct 00
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All officers had brilliant references, character witnesses, and all had good records with plenty of letters from the public thanking them from help with various incidents in their careers etc.
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Craig W
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Registered: 31st Oct 00
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All have to pay £250 compensation each. The PS got a £400 fine, and the 2 PC's got a £250 fine.
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Brett
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Registered: 16th Dec 02
Location: Manchester
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quote:
Originally posted by Ian
Easily done though. I would beat up scum-bags given the opportunity.
Wouldn't really be fair tho would it, as if they defended themselves they'd be sent down for assaulting an officer too 
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ed
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Registered: 10th Sep 03
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CS Gas shouldn't be used as freely as it is. For some reason there are still officers out there who insist on spraying so much on people at close ranget that it scars them.
As for this case, seems that it's not only the officers at fault.
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a_j_mair
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Registered: 23rd Jan 04
Location: Scotland
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sounds like a bit of a hardy guy, if being struck with batons and cs spray with no effect
[Edited on 02-03-2006 by a_j_mair]
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Tom J
Organiser: South Wales
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Registered: 8th Sep 03
Location: Bridgend
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if he was drugged up or something then you could chop his legs off and he woudlnt feel it
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psycho sport
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Registered: 27th Mar 03
Location: Guildford Surrey Drives: Vauxhall Monaro
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2 weapons... a horse and a batton! PMSL
How could he have used the horse in an aggresive manner? picked it up and swung it at them?! LoL
Polics have to protect themselves aswell as others seems like they made the right decisions.
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Mad Moe
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Registered: 14th Jun 01
Location: Northumberland
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It sound to me like the person who gave the Coppers the infomation on the man should be the one on trial and losing their job
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Craig W
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Registered: 31st Oct 00
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quote:
Originally posted by ed
CS Gas shouldn't be used as freely as it is. For some reason there are still officers out there who insist on spraying so much on people at close ranget that it scars them.
As for this case, seems that it's not only the officers at fault.
Believe it or not police officers are trained to use CS gas before using their batons.
I'd rather be hit with the baton first...
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Craig W
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Registered: 31st Oct 00
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quote:
Originally posted by psycho sport
2 weapons... a horse and a batton! PMSL
How could he have used the horse in an aggresive manner? picked it up and swung it at them?! LoL
Polics have to protect themselves aswell as others seems like they made the right decisions.
Yeah because a 1.5tonne horse kicking out at you wouldn't hurt would it 
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