AK
Member
Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
User status: Offline
|
i know some people will view it as 'as much as possible' but here goes...
Take a car.... say these weights
800kg
1000kg
1200kg
1400kg
and FWD/RWD/4WD
what do you think the peak power should/would be before it starts to be detrimental to the cars pace. I.e. too much power!!! Say an 800kg FWD car with 600bhp would not be very tractable 
|
Robin
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Jan 04
Location: Northants Drives: Clio 182 Cup
User status: Offline
|
800kg FWD 240bhp
1000kg FWD 280bhp
1200kg FWD 320bhp
1400kg FWD 350bhp
They'd be the ABSOLUTE limit IMO, not sure about RWD or 4WD, but they'd be a hell of a lot more.
Edit - although it depends on a lot of factors though, car, suspension, tyres, diff etc, so I'm not sure.
[Edited on 31-05-2007 by Robin]
|
Steve X16XE
Member
Registered: 31st Dec 06
Location: Barnsley, South Yorkshire
User status: Offline
|
I'm stupidly going for 800kg and 160bhp. FWD.
|
Rob H
Member
Registered: 28th Oct 00
Location: Staffordshire Drives: Astra SRi
User status: Offline
|
FWD: 300BHP
RWD: 450 maybe?
4WD: 5-600
|
AK
Member
Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
User status: Offline
|
robH - your not grasping the question :/
Robin - i think around 250-300 is possible to be useable on a FWD platform at around 800kg... but i'd need to be setup well  (and NA ) BUT i dont hink it goes up that much with weight... maybe 400bhp max on a bigger car... its still going to be a dungheap compared to RWD 
I think RWD would be around the same as 4WD, maybe a little less...
PS... i'm talking car that can be built/run without $$$$$$$$ backing etc... so F1 etc is out
|
Robin
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Jan 04
Location: Northants Drives: Clio 182 Cup
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by AK
Robin - i think around 250-300 is possible to be useable on a FWD platform at around 800kg... but i'd need to be setup well (and NA ) BUT i dont hink it goes up that much with weight... maybe 400bhp max on a bigger car... its still going to be a dungheap compared to RWD
I was guesstimating on a BTCC car being 300ish bhp and 1230kg and being quite good. I guess they could take a little more power though, so you're probably closer with your numbers.
Like you say though, even with money thrown at it to make it work, RWD would be better, unless it was a REALLY bad RWD car.
Having never driven a 300bhp car in any form though, I can't accurately say, so I'm just guessing really
|
AK
Member
Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
User status: Offline
|
its not so much power, its more the drive train and delivery...
The TypeR was 300+ and was quite twitchy... 4wd but with Rear bias
The supra was 480 and dangerous
Just been calculating some number with the skyboat... if it makes around 600bhp (i think it should make around 650flywheel, 550whp)... that'll be 460'odd bhp per ton, and 230bhp/litre  yikes.... just thinking is that a bit much for a sunday driver trackday car..
|
Robin
Premium Member
Registered: 7th Jan 04
Location: Northants Drives: Clio 182 Cup
User status: Offline
|
I don't think that's too much, it seems a capable car, and from what you've said, you can adjust it enough to make it drive totally differently, so I'm sure you could make it work perfectly with the power.
That power in a car without all the adjustment would be a waste though.
|
AK
Member
Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
User status: Offline
|
yeah... i suppose that more FULL power..
it can be dialled down power wise, dialed in to being more true 4x4 too...
Its bloody leathel in FULL RWD... when it was about 400bhp it would just spin up all over the shop
Need to get the car weighed too.... i think its under 1400kg now... but i cant r'ber the base figure to work with
Some of the junk thats been ripped out weighed a fair bit, and the 4wheel steering setup that i'll remove is about 10kg too i think.... AC pump was about 4kg, soundeadning around 12kg... seats 35kg....
|
AK
Member
Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
User status: Offline
|
its a fat bastard 1480kg as standard
|
AK
Member
Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
User status: Offline
|
prime example of potentially too much power is the viper engined kitcar in jr's thread......
straight line only use perhaps
|
psycho sport
Member
Registered: 27th Mar 03
Location: Guildford Surrey Drives: Vauxhall Monaro
User status: Offline
|
fwd - 250bhp n/a power sub 1000kg
rwd - 375bhp sub 1300kg
4wd - 400bhp sub 1400kg
|
Lucky B
Member
Registered: 7th Apr 02
Location: Lunatic asylum. Drives: Hard & Fast.
User status: Offline
|
Motor racing 1.01
You can never have to much power.
|
AK
Member
Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
User status: Offline
|
|
Daimo B
Member
Registered: 20th Mar 00
User status: Offline
|
Old style super touring cars were 1 tonne I think and around 300bhp.
Current BTCC cars are 1 tonne still and around 270-280bhp due to smaller inlets ont he air boxes that feed the bodies.
Its more a question of what engine can fit in a 800kg car that car give the power without effecting the weight. Want more than 300, and your looking at nitrous and forced induction, or even (ewww) the dreaded V6's.... I'd say about 300 though in a 800kg car with adiquate setup.
RWD - Well, worlds your oyster. Monaros etc are around the 1400kg region and have 600bhp, same as the DTM cars. So you could ask for a little more, but not much.
4wd, harder than people think. Usually will need a turbo, and the larger the turbo the larger the lag, hence the more un-usable it is (See Norris Evo for perfect example of a badly setup car). I'd say around 600bhp also. Never really see any of the old Group B rallycars with like 700-800bhp that handled superbly on teh road (other than that turbo'd/SC Lancia thingy )
That Viper engine in a kit car is purley for penis waving, look how fast i can go. The ladies will love a big engined kit car..... Fun to drive in a straight line, but what about the wet? (Leave it in the garage?????).
[Edited on 01-06-2007 by VXR]
|
Dee
Banned
Registered: 19th Sep 01
User status: Offline
|
what about life after that first bend?
|
AK
Member
Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
User status: Offline
|
Daimo: I wouldnt say the SWB evo is badly setup.... just not focussed on one thing.... trying to be good at everything... and being pretty good with it!
|
