RCS
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Registered: 26th Jan 05
Location: Lichfield/Dundee
User status: Offline
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I've yet to meet a rolling road operator that fully understands the combination of factors they are measuring which results in power at the wheels.
The main thing when using a rolling road is always stick to the same one. Results don't need to be accurate, you just need to know if they are improving.
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Daveskater
Premium Member
Registered: 29th Apr 08
Location: Oxford, UK Drives: Jap wagon
User status: Offline
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When mine was tested it was fully standard except for a de-restricted airbox and got 54.9bhp. Clearly because the published figures are 54bhp, the equipment is wrong 
I agree totally with this thread though, for a start flywheel power is calculated and will not be exact so you only have a general idea anyway. Plus, if they run it 3 times and the power varies each time, of course it's going to be different on a different day in a different place on a different machine. People take RR print outs as gospel and make excuses when it's not good enough to meet their expectations.
Numberwang!
Originally posted by AlunJ
I like you Dave, you are a man of men
Originally Whatapp'd by Neo
Dave's maybe capable of a drive-by cuddle
Look at my pictures
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craig_s
Member
Registered: 5th Mar 06
Location: Birmingham Drives: mk4 astra gsi
User status: Offline
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yeh as most people will go to another place if they get a result they are not happy with.do they usually ask you what sot of power your looking for?
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J da Silva
Member
Registered: 10th Apr 03
Location: The FACTory
User status: Offline
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The thing is Nic, both you and I know the real purpose of a rolling road, especially when you start messing with engine management and software upgrades/diagnostics etc... But you will always get the few critics who listen to 'Toolbox Tony' in the Dog and Duck and then they try and repeat that on here.
The recent thread where the conversation ended up being a bickering session over whether it was a BOV or a dump valve etc was absolutely hilarious, to read such clueless posts is completely laughable, yet people like this may give someone the wrong advice regarding a more important matter and end up costing someone alot of money. 
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N3CRO
Member
Registered: 12th Apr 07
Location: Sandy, Bedfordshire
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Daveskater
When mine was tested it was fully standard except for a de-restricted airbox and got 54.9bhp. Clearly because the published figures are 54bhp, the equipment is wrong
I agree totally with this thread though, for a start flywheel power is calculated and will not be exact so you only have a general idea anyway. Plus, if they run it 3 times and the power varies each time, of course it's going to be different on a different day in a different place on a different machine. People take RR print outs as gospel and make excuses when it's not good enough to meet their expectations.
They say that cars are supposed to lose so much power a year but thats clearly not true if ya Corsa is still putting out that number, 12v or not.
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J da Silva
Member
Registered: 10th Apr 03
Location: The FACTory
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by RCS
I've yet to meet a rolling road operator that fully understands the combination of factors they are measuring which results in power at the wheels.
The main thing when using a rolling road is always stick to the same one. Results don't need to be accurate, you just need to know if they are improving.
+1
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alanvtec
Member
Registered: 12th Jul 09
User status: Offline
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1/4 mile times are more important i wouold say. But i agree when i honda turned up with 180lbft we all questioned it LOL
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richc
Member
Registered: 24th Mar 07
Location: Ilkeston
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by J da Silva
quote:
Originally posted by RCS
I've yet to meet a rolling road operator that fully understands the combination of factors they are measuring which results in power at the wheels.
The main thing when using a rolling road is always stick to the same one. Results don't need to be accurate, you just need to know if they are improving.
+1
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Nic Barnes
Member
Registered: 5th Apr 04
Location: nowhere near ginger people
User status: Offline
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THUMBS
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corsasriboy
Member
Registered: 23rd Mar 07
Location: leicestershire
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by CorsAsh
Graphs are only really any good for spotting any bad points in the power delivery, dips in the curve, flat spots etc.
The numbers are pretty irrelevant, if the car feels fast enough for you then great, if not, modify it for more power.
i agree with this
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antnee
Member
Registered: 30th Dec 07
Location: Cov Drives: Clio 197
User status: Offline
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1/4 mile times is what is important, shows if you can drive the car too 
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swill_omnibus
Member
Registered: 12th Dec 07
Location: : S. wales Drives: Dodge Caliber
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Jambo
I blame Steve
What have I done  
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Rick Draper
Member
Registered: 10th Feb 01
Location: Cheshire
User status: Offline
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TBH i am not really that arsed by RR results. Yep you get a power figure but its all down to how the power is delivered and how the car drives and performs on the road. Onba RR its easier to hold a car at certain revs and load points than it is during live mapping. However live mapping can highlight deficiencies in a map the rolling road cannot imho wop, likewise a rr can highlight other issues a live map cannot.
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taylorboosh
Member
Registered: 3rd Apr 07
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by J da Silva
The thing is Nic, both you and I know the real purpose of a rolling road, especially when you start messing with engine management and software upgrades/diagnostics etc... But you will always get the few critics who listen to 'Toolbox Tony' in the Dog and Duck and then they try and repeat that on here.
The recent thread where the conversation ended up being a bickering session over whether it was a BOV or a dump valve etc was absolutely hilarious, to read such clueless posts is completely laughable, yet people like this may give someone the wrong advice regarding a more important matter and end up costing someone alot of money.
on mine its a recirc valve tbh 
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broster
Premium Member
Registered: 6th Dec 02
Location: Drives: E39
User status: Offline
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What people need to bare in mind is that a rolling road is a tool for tuning,
We use our rolling road to show improvments gained from mapping, or modifying engine parts etc.
on a rolling road day we use it to compare the power reading of one car to another.
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Nic Barnes
Member
Registered: 5th Apr 04
Location: nowhere near ginger people
User status: Offline
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thats why id use same place. shows the differences on same rolling road. but basically from now on, all rolling road results have to be rubished as useless information. i own a keyboard. i have that right.
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Daveskater
Premium Member
Registered: 29th Apr 08
Location: Oxford, UK Drives: Jap wagon
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by craig_s
yeh as most people will go to another place if they get a result they are not happy with.do they usually ask you what sot of power your looking for?
Exactly.
Yeah, when mine was run he said "what were you expecting?", I said 54 and we both agreed that it was bang on the money. Then we all had tea and scones
Numberwang!
Originally posted by AlunJ
I like you Dave, you are a man of men
Originally Whatapp'd by Neo
Dave's maybe capable of a drive-by cuddle
Look at my pictures
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Nic Barnes
Member
Registered: 5th Apr 04
Location: nowhere near ginger people
User status: Offline
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why say what your expecting? your not expecting anything. if you are, then you clearly know more than the people opperating the rolling road.
put it on, it gets what it gets. thats the end of it. its either good, average, or bad. then post it on the net, and everyone can say how the rollers are out. seems the done thing.
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broster
Premium Member
Registered: 6th Dec 02
Location: Drives: E39
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Nic Barnes
why say what your expecting? your not expecting anything. if you are, then you clearly know more than the people opperating the rolling road.
put it on, it gets what it gets. thats the end of it. its either good, average, or bad. then post it on the net, and everyone can say how the rollers are out. seems the done thing.
the done this is to say the only reliable results are from a dyno dynamics rolling road.
this is sadly not the case.
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Daveskater
Premium Member
Registered: 29th Apr 08
Location: Oxford, UK Drives: Jap wagon
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Nic Barnes
why say what your expecting? your not expecting anything. if you are, then you clearly know more than the people opperating the rolling road.
put it on, it gets what it gets. thats the end of it. its either good, average, or bad. then post it on the net, and everyone can say how the rollers are out. seems the done thing.
I was expecting it to get standard power from a standard engine. It succeeded in doing this. If it was chipped, cammed, ported, polished and carbed, then it would be a case of see what it gets, maybe have a rough estimate of what you think it'll get based on other similar tuned engines and see how it compares to that.
Numberwang!
Originally posted by AlunJ
I like you Dave, you are a man of men
Originally Whatapp'd by Neo
Dave's maybe capable of a drive-by cuddle
Look at my pictures
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sand-eel
Member
Registered: 15th Mar 07
Location: carluke/braidwood--IRNBRULAND
User status: Offline
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They do try to match the speeds thats why its run usually in 4th gear as it gives a 1:1 ratio, some cars are different though.
The rollers have a load put on them, like a brake, then depending how fast the rollers are spun the computer works out torque and bhp through calculations.
Another thing people seen to think is wrong is Maha rollers as they have 2 rollers for each wheel meaning there will be more drag meaning the result is always wrong, TBH I think the designers actually know better, thats why they designed it like that.
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sand-eel
Member
Registered: 15th Mar 07
Location: carluke/braidwood--IRNBRULAND
User status: Offline
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fuck my reply is a bit late.
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sand-eel
Member
Registered: 15th Mar 07
Location: carluke/braidwood--IRNBRULAND
User status: Offline
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I was asked my expected power so they could set the graph, so it didn't go off the scale or something.
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broster
Premium Member
Registered: 6th Dec 02
Location: Drives: E39
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by sand-eel
They do try to match the speeds thats why its run usually in 4th gear as it gives a 1:1 ratio, some cars are different though.
The rollers have a load put on them, like a brake, then depending how fast the rollers are spun the computer works out torque and bhp through calculations.
Another thing people seen to think is wrong is Maha rollers as they have 2 rollers for each wheel meaning there will be more drag meaning the result is always wrong, TBH I think the designers actually know better, thats why they designed it like that.
the MAHA actually works out the drag so it could have as many contact poins as you want, the drag is still calculated not guessed
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Nic Barnes
Member
Registered: 5th Apr 04
Location: nowhere near ginger people
User status: Offline
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people probably only question it as they dont understand it. but all the needless internet slaggings off for someone just putting up 3 numbers is rediculous.
kids and their keyboards. best tuners there is. fuck jamsport. dell-sport is where its at.
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